Tuesday, October 18, 2011

Disgraceful Mountaineering pages in the Philippines

I had my first climb February last year. It was the time I was introduced to mountaineering activity in the Philippines. As an adrenaline junkie, trekking indeed awakened the outdoor lust that was lurking within me. Since then a lot has changed, several mountains has been conquered, my group of friends expanded and I learned to accept the brand as a “mountaineer”.

The number of mountaineer enthusiasts in the country grows drastically that it has almost run out of control. A lot of pages were created to serve as the mountaineer’s hub. The most popular are the Philippine Mountaineering page which has 4,222 members and Let’s Unite all Climbers in the Philippines (LUCP) page with 3,104 members. Obviously, the mission of the group is to unite the mountaineers of the country. Sadly though instead of bringing pride by upholding a good mountaineering standards, they bring disgrace to the country’s mountaineering community…

Why?

Because of these...



Such a shame

1.       It is such a shame that these pages bear the name of our country Philippines instilling that the basis of being a mountaineer is by taking BMC 101 mountaineering course and proper decorum is no big deal.
2.       It is such a shame that it has become a freedom wall for expression of hatred and nonsense rather than a useful mountaineering page.
3.       It is such a shame that members are outsmarting each other to the expense of losing their own identity and dignity.
4.       It is such a shame that topics posted are for the benefits of just the chosen few, instead of addressing the concern of the general population.
5.       It is such a shame that members are comparing their degrees, educational attainments, and careers in identifying one’s level of achievements.

Where did all the administrators go?

Pages have administrators, and their role is to administer and monitor the system in order to ensure that group communication is maintained in an accurate and healthy discussion. Philippine Mountaineering has 9 administrators while LUCP has 7. So what are they doing to maintain the healthy discussion in the group pages?!

 Copy pasted below are the fancy broken rules of the pages (yes both pages have exactly the same rules)

1. While debating and discussion is fine but the admin will not tolerate rudeness, profanity, insulting defamatory posts, personal attacks or purposeless inflammatory posts.

2. Advertising of equipments, products and events limited to mountaineering and the outdoors are allowed. Spamming is not. Facebook has spam filters for multiple identical posts

3. Discussion of illegal activities such as use of prohibited drugs pursuant to Republic Act NO. 9165 is not allowed. Please read http://bit.ly/bdJE7b

4. You are solely responsible for your own prestige and reputation. Think before you post. Think before you reply. Your words determine who you are. 

5. This group would like to promote DECENCY in the mountaineering industry to uphold proper decorum and etiquette. Kindly observe ethical behavior when posting. Any post that would dwindle and put the reputation of this group at risk will be deleted. The deletion will serve as a warning and violators will be banned the next time.

6. Discussions of political nature, political groups, and political activities that may impact or affect Public Safety, National Security and Insurgency are likewise not allowed. 

7. We ask you to refrain from annoying behaviors such as flaming http://bit.ly/VODyq , trolling http://bit.ly/troll and sock puppetinghttp://bit.ly/Tg5L4 . When you go out of your way to be annoying, you can expect to be warned or banned.
 

My two-cent worth of thoughts

They can’t be qualified as admin if they can’t even impose at least the group’s rule number 5! DECENCY.

Where is decency here?


An admin from Philippine Mountaineer said they are not deleting nonsense posts because members are demanding for their freedom of speech. After reading and seeing some disturbing viewpoints very vocally expressed over mountaineer pages, I have decided to add my own quiet voice to the argument regarding the right to freedom of expression.

True enough we all have the freedom to express ourselves without the fear of prosecution or intimidation. After all, speech is essential to the existence of mankind. It allows him to control over most natural obstacles that have been hurled at him. However, that very same freedom of speech is also given certain limitations and boundaries that is the reason why there are rules that was created for populous which it supports. No one has limitless freedom, but rather a constricted freedom, and a freedom which we do not fully have nor owned. No matter how brilliant we are, we have a set of rights and practices to follow that restrict our certain accesses and priorities, and limiting our certain functions.


We all can express ourselves but it should be in a responsible manner in order for our civilized society to maintain itself. We have the freedom to share different contesting ideas, coming to creative solutions of problems by our differences. The pages have a thousand members; deleting and banning hundreds of them won’t hurt if it will benefit the remaining thousands.

The power to express ourselves fully is what differentiates us from beasts. We should all be thankful we are given the right of expression, but we also have to be careful not to abuse it. No matter how we view our rights to express ourselves freely, we must consider valuing our precious words, and never compress our most divine freedom - the freedom of thought.

We can’t all be doctors…

36 comments:

  1. Hi Sole Pendulum, I feel the same way. Some people added me to both groups. Every time I open my yahoo, my inbox is flooded with notifications so I checked them out looking forward to something really useful. A lot of members are bashing each other and then when I can't stand the throwing of harsh words, I humbly put a comment in one of the posts and I said I will leave the group. I'm a peaceful person and decent as well. (peaceful daw oh) Mayabang din ako pero tumaob ang yabang ko sa kanila. hahaha.

    For the record, I'm not generalizing. Most of them are friendly people.

    ReplyDelete
  2. This comment has been removed by the author.

    ReplyDelete
  3. Hi Dee!

    I had a private conversation with one of the administrators from LUCP and said they will do something about this issue. I really hope they will, coz the page is really a disgrace not just mountaineering community but most especially to our country.

    ReplyDelete
  4. I used to be a a member and later on installed as admin at LUCP but I decide to remove myself from that page. I am with the more sober Philippine Mountains Forum.

    Don't want to tag myself "mountaineer" because I never am. I decide to introduce bushcraft & survival in Cebu and created a group called CAMP RED. I prefer to be called a bushcrafter or bushman

    ReplyDelete
  5. good to know mam that you are disgusted by the way things are turning out. ibig sabihin may pagasa pa. i deleted my mountaineering fb ages ago, for more reasons than one. akyat na lang ng akyat! karamihan ng mga poser mountaineers na yan, they climb to get laid. binababoy nila ang bundok.

    ReplyDelete
  6. Sir PinoyApache I think you just did the right thing by removing yourself as one of the admins. I admire your principle! I visit your blog and it was great! Thank you for introducing me to bushcrafting. :D

    hi sir backPackingSheet, sana nga po may pag-asa pa talaga, kasi sobrang nakakahiya...

    ReplyDelete
  7. This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

    ReplyDelete
  8. Benj,

    Not interested for a clarification, just do what you have to do. And Missy, can you please delete the comment of Benj stating my full name? Thanks a lot. :)

    ReplyDelete
  9. Mr. Benj Dee - I apologize but I have to edit your post and remove backPackingSheet's name.

    Edited comment of Benj Dee

    "I am the creator of LUCP. I don't remember installing any Pinoy Apache as admin though. Here is the list of admins installed on LUCP

    1. Benj Dee (Me) - Outdoor Pilipinas
    2. Susan Cascante - Isang Lakbay
    3. Edwin Gatia - G2 Society
    4. Adonis Lloren - Freelance
    5. Doc Janiel Leano - Nomads
    6. Nono Fines - DPM
    7. Miguel Mapalad - Yabag

    I already talked to Sole Pedulum about this in FB PM and I promise to take action. It's really not easy but still the buck stops with me. It takes time for an online community to reach its maturity as much as I want to expedite it.

    I would like to talk to (backpacking sheet) ********* and Pinoy Apache to clarify some things.

    If you'd like to talk and sit on this please contact me at

    benj.m.dee@gmail.com
    https://www.facebook.com/benj.dee "

    ReplyDelete
  10. The writer's primary role is to inform society. This thing that the writer wrote is just right. Let's use this article to make things better and not bother her personal life.

    ReplyDelete
  11. BTW, I am not using PinoyApache in FB, Benjie. You did not install me as admin, but somebody else did. Anyway, you can't remember my name but I have some posts at LUCP.

    ReplyDelete
  12. I know Sir Apache as one of the pioneers in Cebu mountaineering. I have read his Babag and Napo tales.

    Yes, I agree that you need not bother the author about her post. She just shares her view of what the mountaineering society has come to at the advent of these ambitious pages.

    You created that monster of a page Benj, so it is expected of you to clean that mess up. Mountaineering had change ever since.

    BPS

    ReplyDelete
  13. This comment has been removed by the author.

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  14. Mam Imelda, the owner of this blog and I already talked even before your first comment in this post. We talked immediately when this blog entry was created. Thus, there is no need to explain why she wrote this. And to clarify, I am not even bothering her. I even praised her for this post when I first read it because this has been the eye opener we have been waiting. I even asked her options on how this post will be shared to the members of LUCP.

    The screenshots of FB Post No. 1, 2, and 4 specifically the posts by El Tarik, Krizzy Andrea and by a certain Montera Chikadora were posts in Philippine Mountaineering. It is managed by different people and is not in any way related to Let’s Unite/LUCP. The rules in their group are just copied from the rules the LUCP Admin team has created. If you have questions about these posts, please contact the admin of the Philippine Mountaineering Facebook Group in this link https://www.facebook.com/groups/118721218210996/

    The screenshot of the 3rd Facebook post in this blog entry is a post by Geronimo Rectum Pablo in Let's Unite (LUCP) https://www.facebook.com/groups/letsuniteph/. It was denunciated even before Sole Pedulum wrote this blog entry. Later on, we discovered that Geronimo is a rectal colon cancer survivor and that's the reason why he posts such. It takes a lot of fortitude to understand. If you want to know more about the story, please message him here https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=588483537

    In the early days of LUCP, there has been a lot of conflicts of ideals and approaches to mountaineering in this group. To rectify these conflicts, I scheduled a grand meetup this coming January. The meet up was fast-tracked because one of the admins, Sir Edwin Gatia, returned to the Philippines. I know that you know: Sir Edwin Gatia is the first summiter of Mt. Guiting Guiting exploration way back 1982. We had an acquaintance party last Saturday Nov 19. The members of LUCP and SRMP and G2 Society met with the members of the Philippine Everest Team, including their team leader Sir Art Valdez, their trainor, Sir Fred Jamili and their Everest traverse finisher, Mam Carina Dayondon. Thus, attenuating conflicts ... promoting companionship. It was an awesome event. I wish you were there.

    But after a few day, I was saddened. I heard that you and Ms. Bernie Dela Cruz had some bad exchange of words. It was posted in the group that I manage which is LUCP and in the other group managed by someone else, Philippine Mountaineering, and it was posted by El Tarik but I think Mr. El Tarik already removed it. I talked to your friend Lek and we sat upon it through PM. I don't know if I was able to make her understand, but what's important for me is… I understand where you and Lek are coming from. I also listened to El Tarik and Ms Bernie side of the story. I guess there is a problem with communication. I even opted to intervene and would like to here it from you. Please tell me. I love to listen.

    Mam Imelda, I apologize for the leniency in implementing the rules we created. As much we want to have full control of the group, I myself decided to be condoning. I have been vigilant in the first few months but based on my experience, austerity makes things only worst. Sir Adonis can attest to that. I myself suffered from consequences of employing coercion in LUCP. But the group is still young. Reaching the maturity of an online community takes time, a lot of grit and most importantly…a lot of patience. And for that, I ask for yours. My only goal is to UNITE. That’s it. No more. No less.

    I would like to hear all the complaints about LUCP but just merely listening to it, won’t lead to an answer. Instead, let’s all be part of the solution. Mam Imelda, I would like to talk to you in private. If you could please email me at benj.m.dee@gmail.com …. it would be my pleasure. I'd love to hear from you. More power to BPS.

    Thanks,
    Benj

    ReplyDelete
  15. Mam Imelda, the owner of this blog and I already talked even before your first comment in this post. We talked immediately when this blog entry was created. Thus, there is no need to explain why she wrote this. And to clarify, I am not even bothering her. I even praised her for this post when I first read it because this has been the eye opener we have been waiting. I even asked her options on how this post will be shared to the members of LUCP.

    The screenshots of FB Post No. 1, 2, and 4 specifically the posts by El Tarik, Krizzy Andrea and by a certain Montera Chikadora were posts in Philippine Mountaineering. It is managed by different people and is not in any way related to Let’s Unite/LUCP. The rules in their group are just copied from the rules the LUCP Admin team has created. If you have questions about these posts, please contact the admin of the Philippine Mountaineering Facebook Group in this link https://www.facebook.com/groups/118721218210996/

    The screenshot of the 3rd Facebook post in this blog entry is a post by Geronimo Rectum Pablo in Let's Unite (LUCP) https://www.facebook.com/groups/letsuniteph/. It was denunciated even before Sole Pedulum wrote this blog entry. Later on, we discovered that Geronimo is a rectal colon cancer survivor and that's the reason why he posts such. It takes a lot of fortitude to understand. If you want to know more about the story, please message him here https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=588483537

    In the early days of LUCP, there has been a lot of conflicts of ideals and approaches to mountaineering in this group. To rectify these conflicts, I scheduled a grand meetup this coming January. The meet up was fast-tracked because one of the admins, Sir Edwin Gatia, returned to the Philippines. I know that you know: Sir Edwin Gatia is the first summiter of Mt. Guiting Guiting exploration way back 1982. We had an acquaintance party last Saturday Nov 19. I invited the members of the Philippine Everest Team, their team leader Sir Art Valdez, their trainor, Sir Fred Jamili and their Everest traverse finisher, Mam Carina Dayondon to meet with the members of LUCP and SRMP and G2 Society to promote companionship. It was an awesome event. I wish you were there.

    But after a few days, I was saddened. I heard that you and Ms. Bernie Dela Cruz had some bad exchange of words. It was posted in the group that I manage which is LUCP and in the other group managed by someone else, Philippine Mountaineering, and it was posted by El Tarik but I think Mr. El Tarik already removed it. I talked to your friend Lek and we sat upon it through PM. I don't know if I was able to make her understand, but what's important for me is… I understand where you and Lek are coming from. I also listened to El Tarik and Ms Bernie side of the story. I guess there is a problem with communication. I even opted to intervene and would like to here it from you. Please tell me. I love to listen.

    Mam Imelda, I apologize for the leniency in implementing the rules we created. As much we want to have full control of the group, I myself decided to be condoning. I have been vigilant in the first few months but based on my experience, austerity makes things only worst. Sir Adonis can attest to that. I myself suffered from consequences of employing coercion in LUCP. I told this story to Mam Lek. The group is still young. Reaching the maturity of an online community takes time, a lot of grit and most importantly…a lot of patience. And for that, I ask for yours. My only goal is to UNITE. That’s it. No more. No less.

    I would like to hear all the complaints about LUCP but just merely listening to it, won’t lead to an answer. Instead, let’s all be part of the solution. Mam Imelda, I would like to talk to you in private. If you could please email me at benj.m.dee@gmail.com …. it would be my pleasure. I'd love to hear from you. More power to BPS.

    Thanks,
    Benj

    ReplyDelete
  16. Like I have said Benj, I am not interested in talking to any person in that group. We'll of course unless they're my previous acquaintances, but certainly not about this matter because the real issue was neglected and instead they employed character assassination which clearly evidences the kind of ethics and values that became a trend in the mountaineering community nowadays. I refuse to go down to their level.

    I have no intention of meeting those mountaineering greats you have mentioned, I think that part of your comment was an unnecessary flaunt of your organizing skills. It will be better left off in your "resume".

    You can talk to Leck, whatever she says, represents what I have to say. I don't know why you insists on calling me by my name when I manifested preference for anonymity. And I was disappointed to have learned that Adonis is taking part in this kerfuffle. I never expected he'll get involved in those mountaineering groups in the first place. I will send you the "copy-pasted" transcript of my conversation with Slamchick via email if I found the time. And please, let's not pollute this blog with trivial matters relating to the recent event. It's unrelated to her post in case you haven't noticed.

    Sole, please delete the comment after Benj have read this, or don't, whatever you prefer to do. I am apologizing in behalf of Benj and myself, for posting unrelated matters here. Thank you very much for the accommodation.

    BPS

    ReplyDelete
  17. Sole Pendulum,

    It would be better for you not to delete my comment and hers. It should be fair for people to read both our premise after you created this blog entry. I want to be fair to everyone that's why I am opening the doors for reconcillation. I am not flaunting but I am entitled to respond with transparency since it will not obscure the unprejudiced context of the whole story.

    Thanks,
    Benj

    ReplyDelete
  18. This comment has been removed by the author.

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  19. I admire the author and I agree with BackpackingSheet. Mountaineering was better when pages like LUCP and Philippine Mountaineering were not created yet sir Benj.

    ReplyDelete
  20. epal lang ang nagsulat neto. Papansin! If you are sincere in making things better bakit di mo ilagay pangalan mo?! Nanggugulo ka lang! I suggest akyat ka ng bundok at patihulog sa bangin. Or tulak nalang kita kung sino ka man.

    ReplyDelete
  21. Wow, the Orcs have finally learned how to read. Sole, I suggest you use the moderation feature with the comments. I can feel that things will get out of hand from hereon. Sorry to have brought this to your site, but this post is something that I just had to share. Thanks for this article.

    ReplyDelete
  22. Malaking bagay itong article na ito. Salamat kay tamanggala. nanakihiya talaga pag nakikita natin na palaging may nag-aaway na mountaineers sa facebook pero kung si backpackingsheet ang magsasalita, hindi ako magtataka kung bakit lalong lalala. ksa kasama namin umakyat dati yan pero nakita ko na bitter padin sya. hindi ako magtataka dahil marami talagang kaaway yan dahil siguro sobrang talino nya pero alanganin ang attitude nya. matalino yan pero may attitude problem. walang pinagkaiba yan sa mga tao dun sa mga fb groups na yun dahil walang alam yan kung hindi magreklamo. sya kasi ang pinakamagaling na mountaineer.

    ReplyDelete
  23. Thank you tamanggala for trying to make the mountaineering community pages a little better. It's a big eye opener indeed for us to see what is happening now. :)

    ReplyDelete
  24. Wow, character assassination at its finest? Lols. Kung bitter ako Sir/Mam, matagal na akong tumigil sa pag-akyat. Nirereklamo ko yung nakita kong mali, alangan namang hindi.

    Hindi ako matalino na mountaineer, I still learn from my mistakes and yours too. At kung ako ang pinakamagaling na mountaineer, malamang hindi mo ako nakasama sa climb. :D

    ReplyDelete
  25. I believe this is worth publishing in order to provide information to aspiring mountaineers. For them to realize earlier what kind of mountaineering society the Philippines has, and be prevented from getting stuck with this kind of sh*ts.

    ReplyDelete
  26. tsk tsk tsk. bad :-( really bad. Asan ang decency. Your comments speak who you are. Gosh. disappointing.

    ReplyDelete
  27. I am an outsider of this group but reading the post and the comments in this article made me believe that a lot of people are misusing social media networks. Where is the education and the learning from your parents people? Have all of them gone with the air in your heads? Where is your decency? Nakakalungkot at nakakasukang basahin ang mga nasa article. Honestly, hindi ko binasa lahat, hindi ko kayang basahin. While some people are trying to uplift and restructure the negative perception of the world towards our country, it is very disappointing to read such articles that exposing the eroding values of the Filipinos nowadays. While plenty of people blame the government for not doing anything that will develop the country, it sad to realize that you are adding to the problem and not becoming part of the solution. My God! this article reflect a disgraceful behavior of the irresponsible Filipinos of this country.

    ReplyDelete
  28. Admins are not admins when they are not doing their part in censoring posts that are obscene and unethical. Freedom of Speech comes with responsibility. Freedom of speech shall not be used to cover hate speech and outright abuse and unethical doings such as obscene speech. The admin can censor libelous speech and other speeches that provokes hate arguments. "THINK, BEFORE YOU CLICK"
    1. Be truthful, accurate and fair.
    2. Verify facts before posting, tweeting or re-tweeting.
    3. Do not do or say anything in social media that you wouldn't do in public.
    4. Remember. Anything you upload can be shared by others.
    5. Try to ignore tweets and comments intended to provoke quarrels.
    6. Acknowledge, delete and or correct errors, and apologize if necessary.
    7. Don't do anything stupid.

    ReplyDelete
  29. You know Sole, maybe you hit a spot. Is it just me or a very profane mountaineering page was just taken down. I can't seem to find it anymore. I don't know if you are familiar with the "Unsensitive Drunken Outdoorsmen" page. They are dedicated to posting pics of people pooping in the mountains. Or just plain poops. What is sad is that one of the admin there is an old school mountaineer and an active member (or officer?) of MFPI.

    If that is the case, I congratulate you Ms. Sole for making the online community of mountain climbers a bit better. :)

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. may we know the name of that "old school" mountaineer and member of MFPI??...

      Delete
  30. Nah, i don't know them. And I am glad I don't :D
    Thanks for the support BPS. Cheers!

    ReplyDelete
  31. tao lng ako, pero ang mahalaga d ako nkksakit ng tao... anu pa man ang pagkakaiba ntin sa pananaw at prinsipyo, ang mahalaga sa lahat, pag nagkta tyo sa bundok at kinailangan mo ang tulong ko, buong puso kong iaabot ang kamay ko.

    ReplyDelete
  32. Same sentiments here Missy. The page should be greatly monitored and all posts should be mountaineering related. Puro bashing ang nangyayari tapos pag nagoffer ka ng advice or nag correct ka ng mali ikaw pa ung mali tas pagmumumurahin ka. Pero there are some person that are quite helpful there.

    ReplyDelete
  33. I quit LUCP because I don't belong there. PERIOD. I am PinoyApache; part-Pinoy, part-Basque and part-Chiricahua. The wilderness is my canvass, hardship is my way of life and the mountains are my playground. I support Sole Pendulum as a fellow blogger and she is entitled to her opinions and nobody - read this NOBODY - could take it away from her.

    ReplyDelete

I may not be able to reply to your comment/s, but rest assured that I am reading each and everyone of them. Thank you for dropping by and taking some time to drop me a note. I do appreciate.

I wish you luck and happiness. Keep on travelling, find your happy place. :)